The things Apple didn't announce

Yeah, Apple fired a warning shot in Europe with this morning's O2 announcement, but there's sure a lot more on our minds that Apple didn't address at the mini press conference. Here are some of them in convenient bullet point form. The things Apple didn't announce today:

• Which carrier will be carrying the iPhone in France (we hear it's Orange).
  
• Which carrier will be carrying the iPhone in Germany (we hear it's T-Mobile, or maybe Vodafone).
  
• Is O2 seriously paying out 40% of plan revenue for exclusivity?
• Why anyone will pay for flat rate data when only 30% of the UK will be using EDGE.
• 3G iPhone.

Got anything to add? Let it all out in the comments. Rumor is the Germany announcement could come tomorrow, followed by France on Thursday, with T-Mobile and Orange doing the respective honors, but we would've rather gotten all this hashed out today and a little more sleep the rest of this week.

[Felix Fdot @ Sep 18th 2007 6:44AM]

ok, after this jobsonouncement i'm pretty shure the 3g thing won't come until q2 2008 - starting the annual renewment of iphones like that of ipods.. only thing left for me of interest (as a german) is whether the german keyboard is realised well, then i'll drop that sad f700 vodafone story and go for the big t.

[cmc07 @ Sep 18th 2007 6:48AM]

SJ said " 3G needs to get back up to 5+ hours, something we think well see later next year" I read that as "We'll bring out the 3G iPhone next year"

[Paul Addison @ Sep 18th 2007 6:49AM]

It will be interesting to compare pricing on the French / German iPhone with respect to UK pricing. Will it be just us or the rest of Europe that Apple applies there crazy currency conversion policy to.

[anarchron @ Sep 18th 2007 6:56AM]

If there's money to be made, why not? It's not as if Apple cares about your wallet anyway.

[Alan Partridge @ Sep 18th 2007 7:04AM]

In the UK and US they have priced the 8GB iPhone at the same price as the 16GB Touch. That would make the Euro price about €399

[Iain @ Sep 18th 2007 7:15AM]

Once again, Apple bends their UK customers over and, well, I think you get the picture...

[Paul @ Sep 18th 2007 11:05AM]

So wait, you're saying, 399 USD and 399 GBP and 399 EUR aren't the same?

but they look the same... ;P

[Damien Guard @ Sep 18th 2007 6:54AM]

A great UI and the iPhones other cool features are nice-to-haves. The ability to make voice and data calls on a wide variety of networks (includes UMTS/3G) is far more important to me and no doubt to many high-end users. How many of those 80% are still prepared to switch now?

[)amien

[unsigned @ Sep 18th 2007 9:52AM]

I switched from a HTC Tytn (at&t) 8525 that of course has 3G. Because the wifi actually seeks out networks and doesn't drain the battery like the Tytn does and the fact the HSDPA network in Chicagoland kinda hoovers, I don't miss it. Edge on the iPhone *feels* almost as fast as 3G on the Tytn most of the time. The rest of the iPhone is worlds ahead of the WM5 devices, its not even funny.

[Damien Guard @ Sep 18th 2007 10:27AM]

My TyTN was an absolute lifesaver when I was on holiday in Japan. Their network is UMTS/3G only and you can't buy even a pay-as-you-go unless you are permenantly resident in the country.

Free and hotspot WiFi is very uncommon outside of some large city spots and EDGE doesn't seem to fare much better across Europe.

[)amien

[Xavier Gill @ Sep 18th 2007 6:58AM]

Video recording, MMS, voice recording, voice dialing, copy and paste, flash support, hard-disk use, saving images/files from browser, A2DP, bluetooth file transfer, bluetooth modem, use any MP3 as ringtone, ability to delete individual text messages, wifi file transfer to other iPhones, 3rd party apps etc etc

[Bad Beaver @ Sep 18th 2007 7:12AM]

What he said, basically.
+Simultaneous multilangual keyboard
+Proper iCal sync
-MMS. Should be there, but nobody uses it anyway.

[Alan Partridge @ Sep 18th 2007 7:21AM]

Say I wanted to download a file from a host like rapidshare and then email that file to a few people through GMail, I couldn't do that with the iPhone right? But I can do that on the PSP and not with homebrew, with Sony's own firmware!

Hell if you buy the camera attachment you can record and edit a video, and then upload it to Youtube! I would have thought that those kind of features would be very popular with iPhone users.

[Ryan @ Sep 18th 2007 9:03AM]

@ Bad Beaver: Yeah sure, no-one uses MMS. Apart from the +1 million Britons every daily who use it to send picture messages.
http://news.softpedia.com/news/1-Million-Picture-Messages-Sent-Each-Day-in-the-UK-43331.shtml

[Richard @ Sep 18th 2007 7:02AM]

So do we have any funky laws in the Uk that say operators have to unlock phones at our request? Please say we do as I have no intention to use O2 as I left them (cellnet) 8 years ago for being shoddy.

[Iain @ Sep 18th 2007 7:14AM]

No, we don't. Networks have no legal obligation to do so.
But given there are free iPhone unlock apps now, who cares?

[Richard @ Sep 18th 2007 7:23AM]

Free iPhone unlock apps that may or may not be defeated by Apple, that's my only worry. If I start using an iPhone that suddenly stops working after a software update I'll have to wait for someone to figure out how to unlock it again.

Still I don't think I quite want an iPhone as it is now, 3G I can live without, most of my browsing is done over WiFi, it's the endless list of other things I want such as Video Recording, MMS, Copy/Paste etc etc, you know the list.

[Iain @ Sep 18th 2007 9:24AM]

True enough, there is the ever-present possibility that the unlock apps stop working.
However, since O2 isn't likely to give up it's golden goose, no matter how nicely you ask, it would seem to be the answer. Unless, of course, you're willing to risk your warranty with a hardware mod or use the method with the cloned SIM (or whatever it is...).

[Ant @ Sep 18th 2007 7:03AM]

I'm feeling a bit sorry for Apple at moment. I've been laying into them about what iPhone hasn't got and all the money the networks charge (the networks are the con artists here me thinks). It's always the same.

Let me just say something positive for a change. I have the choice whether to spend my money on Apple gadgets or just go instore and play with them for a bit. I'm glad Apple create these things for us and put more than just a bit of thought into their design, unlike many others. Apple makes me happy and get a bit of a tingle when I see new stuff in the Apple store that I can play with.

Yes, I'm glad Steve is still at Apple and the Keynotes are like a real event I mark in my diary. We all have our ideas of what we want to see and when we don't see it we are naturally disappointed, but at the end of the day, at some point in the near future, we know that Apple will listen to part (or all) of what we are saying and change future product generations to suite.

Yep, Apple makes me happy and I’m lucky to live in a world were I can look forward to things like this and not where my next meal is coming from. From now on I’m just going to enjoy the ride a bit more

[lassi @ Sep 18th 2007 7:29AM]

look, if the networks are the con artists then sell your phone unlocked free to use with any network, visualmail seems just a tacky good excuse to be locked to specific networks.


but that way(unlocked) you could milk far less money, you see n95 street price unlocked and then see that it's free on similar contracts that iphone is nearly 300 pounds for.. you think anyone would buy the iphone for 800 pounds+? unlocked they could have done an european wide launch, too. europe is a lot of countries and going country by country doesn't really seem like they'll make an impact on the mobile business as a whole at all...

[TeddyN @ Sep 18th 2007 7:05AM]

Well obviously I'm sorely disappointed that there's no 3G, I see absolutely no reason to buy a UK iPhone. I live in central London, and I never see EDGE on my blackberry when I'm at home; only GPRS. I'm going to wait for Apple's next upgrade, which will hopefully won't be too long :( .....
http://www.thestreet.com/s/apple-to-introduce-faster-iphone-next-year/newsanalysis/techtelecom/10379941.html?puc=_tscs

Other questions though...
Will an unlocked US iPhone with an o2 sim card have visual voicemail enabled?
Will the iPhone be an upgrade option for people that already have an o2 contract? (Every year they let you have a free upgrade, or an upgrade with a smaller fee on top than buying new)
Would a pay as you go sim card work with the UK iPhone?
What happens if you exceed the web page limit of their 'unlimited' data policy?


Lots of questions... :(

[Greg @ Sep 18th 2007 7:06AM]

Guys don't be alarmed by this "only 30% EDGE" thing.
EDGE is an add-on to GPRS which is available 100% on the network. EDGE will get you ~100-150k bandwiths while GPRS only 30k.
Yes it's slow but you DO have access to the internet everywhere.

[Matt Jones @ Sep 18th 2007 7:18AM]

Yeah that's great, but why would I pay 269 notes for something without 3G, MMS, Video, any real smartphone functionality and a crap camera, tied to and an 18 month contract for a minimu of 35 notes per month when I can get a quadband, 3G, Wi-fi enabled device with a 3MP camera, full QWERTY, video recorder on a contract with a 1GB fair useage policy for viryually nothing for the phone and the same price on contract?

The iPhone is a 2 year old phone with an interface ahead of everyone else. So basically the only thing it has over other phones is it's look and feel. Great for the iBoiyz, not so much for the rest of us who actually want our devices to do things beyond what Apple tell us we want to do.

[Tony @ Sep 18th 2007 7:17AM]

We need MMS messaging, or the average user is going to think their iPhone is 'broken' because it can't do picture messaging. 3G needs to come next year, but even that may be too late.

[Vincent @ Sep 18th 2007 7:23AM]

Well, I know all the people have been blaming the edge. However, as the first US design Phone(so far by the info, iPhone is the first us design phone) all others are imported. iPhone is a perfect US phone industry mark stone. America spend awful a lot money to build his facilities after WWII,(including landlines, water pipe, rail service), everything are still running perfectly over the past 50 years. Most US residents are comfortable with the way they are. Calling from a landline or using dial up internet connection is perfectly normal. Over 70% of the mobile phone users are still using 2G phone, simply making a call and text. nothing else, video call? NOOO.

And here we go, NOW, it is way to expensive to switch hardwares for government and companies. They rather improve or use those existing hardwares or services (like landlines and edge network.)

iPhone fits perfectly of the 80% US user!! (hit me if i am wrong :))

[Matt Jones @ Sep 18th 2007 7:51AM]

ummmm, the mobile network hasn't been around that long? I do kind of take your point though, US cars asre still stuck in the 1960's, only with more beverage holders and lights. Equally US mobiles seem to be stuck a few years behind everyone else. However, this isn't the US and to roll out a phone across a continent that has become accustomed to certain facilities on their phone is a mistake.

I doubt it will flop, consumers on the whole are easy to manipulate and Apple has done a very good job of throwinig up a smokescreen around the many flaws in it's products. They have an excellent marketing machine, and a brilliant design team. They just need to realise that Europe is a different market - the iPhone fits America because of the various 3G issues that are flying around there but it doesn't fit Europe - no MMS, no Video and no 3G is just not acceptable. After the initial rush I think we'll see a downturn in pickup and a lot of iPhones on eBay.

[Vincent @ Sep 18th 2007 7:42AM]

@Matt
You are right, iPhone should customize to fit Europe market.

[Soren @ Sep 18th 2007 7:23AM]

I find it odd, to say at least, that they are rolling out an edge network now just for the iphone. Stupid investment since hsdpa is the only way to go for data now.
It would make more sense just using gprs that is availbale everywhere in europe even though it is slower.

I also fint it a bit odd that the 3g handset is excused with bad battery times. Samsung and Nokia has pbhnes with hsdpa and wifi, video, camera etc and manage to get decent battery life (sure they are not iphones)
I think that apple really just want to squeeze every possible buck out of the iphone v1 before bumping the specs and everybody upgrades (man they almost treat their loyal customers like sheeps)

For me personally i will not buy an iphone that doent have hsdpa since i use it with my laptop all the time.
utms/3g coverage is comon in most places with speeds up to 3mbit being more and more comon.

Apple - your phone is really fantastic and inovative when it comes to interface but too old school for europe when it comes to data!

The trend goes towards €30 for flatrate data with speed up to 3mbit in differnt contries in Europe.

I find it curious that Apple havent annouced any thing yet regarding scandinavia since it is the melting pot when it comes to mobile telecommunication - i guess it is because by law a company cannot commit persons to a contract period for longer than 6 moths


In my eyes the deal inst that atractive - and now with the ipod touch as well in the market it will take a bit a steam of the phone hunger since it doeant have optimal specs for europe

[Jeremy @ Sep 18th 2007 7:29AM]

One thing that's significantly more important to me than the 3G / EDGE speed issue is that the iPhone is apparently a "Class C" GPRS device, meaning it cannot be involved in a data connection at the same time as a voice connection.

So as long as you are surfin' the web, or using IM, or whatever else, you CANNOT receive calls!

Regardless of the arguments over EDGE speed vs. 3G speed vs. coverage, this is a huge PITA. Please, someone deny this as all I can find is unofficial statements - it needs to be class A to manage simultaneous data/voice as far as I understand, if it even had this capability I'd be a lot happier...

[geekmorgan @ Sep 18th 2007 10:51AM]

Whoa there buddy.. if you're on a website with the iPhone and a call comes it, you can answer the call. It doesn't block out voice data, it just switches modes. If you're loading someting on YouTube when a call comes in, the download pauses, you take the call, then when you're done the download resumes.

[Jeremy @ Sep 18th 2007 11:02AM]

Thanks, I stand corrected (thanks Greg too!) :)

But.... if for example you are logged in to a "service", for example, monitoring or dealing share prices ... or a web based IM service, these services assume a connection will stay active and use a heartbeat or similar to check the client is still there.

Won't they fail to get heartbeat responses, see a disconnection and drop your session if you spend any amount of time on a voice call?

Reconnecting the socket won't resume the application (or applet) session so you'll have to go back through the logon process. Fair enough web sites will for the most part be OK as they are short bursts of data but this feels somewhat clunky when compared with the always-on 3G alternative.

Shame they couldn't have made it a Class A GPRS device, but maybe that entails a lot more cost.

For the record, my position is I think it looks great and wish I could justify the price, but it seems to be a big step down from my current N80 in actual phone functionality, and I really dislike that too... Maybe I'll accidentally drop my iPod and have to replace it ;)

[Panq @ Sep 18th 2007 4:41PM]

Jeremy: You seem to be under the impression that the iPhone supports third party applications and instant messaging...

[Jeremy @ Sep 19th 2007 3:59AM]

Panq: By application, I was referring primarily to web-apps, applets if you like (but not excluding potential 3rd party applications... supported or otherwise). There are already many web based IM clients and some designed with an iPhone style UI. My comments are general with regard to any app/applet that may require a stateful data connection.

As I currently run a share dealing java application on my N80 I'd have to resort to the web-browser version of the client, hence my concern that it's just not gonna work cleanly if the connection keeps breaking. This is my particular circumstance, but I'm querying whether in general it causes issues with apps (web or otherwise!) that maintain a stateful connection.

[Reloaded @ Sep 18th 2007 7:31AM]

Any news for Italy?? is it ever possible?
I did a couple of considerations on my blog (sorry, only italian) about the price, 269£ isn't a bit too much? the right exchange should be 200...what if in others European's countries they take as effective price the UK's one and then they convert to Euros? Double damage for customers
http://www.mytechnology.eu

[Greg @ Sep 18th 2007 7:36AM]

Yea right...

Typical speeds (while commuting) here in Switzerland are
HSDPA: 160k
3G: 150k
EDGE: 120-150k

These are my measurements with real life data. I ran some speed tests several times with various handsets and always got the same results. I don't get ANY benefit from 3G except my battery is flat in less than 2 days.

BTW, I am using an HTC smartphone with EDGE, perfectly happy with it. Not interested in buying an iPhone. With that said, I think Apple's EDGE+Wifi concept is not bad at all.

[junjie1800 @ Sep 18th 2007 7:39AM]

Come to think of it, Apple is such a prick. They might as well open up to all carriers at once to save all these trouble and nonsense.

[Greg @ Sep 18th 2007 7:41AM]

it's the other way around

when you dial or receive a call your data connection will disconnect. as soon as you hang up it reconnects automatically.

So it's not true you can't make calls while surfing the web...

[Jeremy @ Sep 18th 2007 8:10AM]

Hmmm, ok, I did read stories of people being connected to various online "services" and not receiving calls when it was launched in the U.S., maybe it was user-error as that would make more sense.

However, I guess most apps that requires a constant connection (e.g. IM, live share dealing / price monitoring) use a heartbeat system to verify clients are still alive, and they are going to fall over and disconnect when you receive a call that breaks the data connection.

That's probably "a bad thing" for IM as the break will not be "clean" and you will appear to be online for a while when in actual fact you have dropped the data connection and are chatting to someone.

[PEZ @ Sep 18th 2007 7:42AM]

Here are the answers in convenient bullet form:

* This event wasnt about France.
* This event wasnt about germany.
* None of your business.
* Because they will need it for Visual Voicemail.
* There isnt one yet - apple dosnt talk about products that arent available yet.

[Deputy Doffoos @ Sep 18th 2007 7:53AM]

They didn't announce a FIX for iPod TOUCH Screens!!!!

[Ireland @ Sep 18th 2007 7:55AM]

No 3G, they can stick that iPhone up their asses if they think we'll buy it without 3G over here. No sale!

[xgwynn @ Sep 18th 2007 8:14AM]

I don't think it will flop, but if it doesn't do well in the UK because of its problems (lack of 3G, MMS, A2DP etc) then it would force Apple to release the updated version sooner, with all the features that it should have right now.

I'm pretty disappointed, I really thought we would get the 3G iPhone, and maybe a larger 16GB drive.

I'll probably pick up a Touch and wait for the proper iPhone to come out next year, which I would say a few other people will do.

[agentejohnson @ Sep 18th 2007 8:18AM]

Maybe a little info on when and who will bring it here to Spain should help too

[ben @ Sep 18th 2007 8:20AM]

Why does this blog, and apple, apparently, think Europe just stops at France, Germany and the UK? I live in Spain and would love an iPhone some day, but no-one even mentions other countries such as this one, Italy etc. I think Spain has a pretty advanced 3G network, so I guess we won't be seeing anything here til iphone gets 3g. Very annoying.

[Soren @ Sep 18th 2007 9:01AM]

the rumour mill says it will be telefonica (sucks) that will win in spain (they own O2)
I can imagne it will come rather wuick to spain sine one can commit a subscriber to an 18 moth contract.

I live in spain as well - and there are no way i wil change to telefonica (they suck) or vodafone (they suck and cheat) Orange has better deals in general.

[RosWan @ Sep 18th 2007 8:28AM]

Which carrier will be carrying the iPhone in Poland (Also Orange like in France?)

[STrRedWolf @ Sep 18th 2007 8:48AM]

They forgot the Beatles catalog and the Yellow Submarine iPod.

[Ben @ Sep 18th 2007 9:00AM]

30% 2.5G coverage? Wow, that's about the same functionality as the ipod touch, right?!

[Suppo @ Sep 18th 2007 9:06AM]

Is there only three countries in Europe?

I think Apple's strategy is to make a launch to these three and after it creates more demand on other countries they can negotiate better deals with carriers. I love Apple products but they are too greedy.

[tehpyro @ Sep 18th 2007 9:40AM]

With apple shoving iPhone down our throats I am starting to wonder... WHERE THE HELL IS LEOPARD! I know there is supposed to be a month till the release bug I haven't read the word leaopard in a blog or on a website in like 2 months! whats the deal?!!!